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Old April 28, 2020, 09:14   #1
rowjimmy
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Sold Out?

I was looking at some scopes and they're all sold out... WTF? Are people thinking the Boogaloo is happening? I was apprehensive to pull the trigger at $400-500 and noe they're gone.

I've got a DSA mount and no optic.

How would an Aimpoint pro hold up on 7.62? I was gonna get a Primary Arms or Vortex but NADA.
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Old April 28, 2020, 11:13   #2
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Supply chain. With both of those either the scope or the components are made in china. Maybe a few more than normal have been bought, but the supply has not been able to keep up with normal demand.
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Old April 28, 2020, 11:16   #3
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Originally Posted by rowjimmy View Post
I was looking at some scopes and they're all sold out... WTF? Are people thinking the Boogaloo is happening? I was apprehensive to pull the trigger at $400-500 and noe they're gone.

I've got a DSA mount and no optic.

How would an Aimpoint pro hold up on 7.62? I was gonna get a Primary Arms or Vortex but NADA.
I'm guessing that the Chinese manufactured scopes will be in really short supply. Of course, that'll stress the entire market for optics no matter where they're made.

And, of course, a huge chunk is Hecho en China...

Forrest
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Old April 28, 2020, 15:41   #4
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If only there was a US made red dot (with BDC, even) with great glass that has a gold ring lifetime warranty and will stand up to the abuse of anything under 50 cal...

https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-VX-Fr.../dp/B07RV4RSNL

In stock, for $349. If only...
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Old April 28, 2020, 15:45   #5
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Fuggin' Americans.

Too bad, eh?
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Old April 28, 2020, 18:17   #6
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This is ideal IMO, a bit spendy when not on sale though.
https://www.swfa.com/swfa-ss-hd-1-6x....html?___SID=U

The 1-4 is a bit cheaper, but it's also on back order.
https://www.swfa.com/swfa-ss-1-4x24-....html?___SID=U


These are something I'm kinda curious about, Steiner 4x prism sight.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1022378347
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Old April 28, 2020, 18:23   #7
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Originally Posted by kotengu View Post
If only there was a US made red dot (with BDC, even) with great glass that has a gold ring lifetime warranty and will stand up to the abuse of anything under 50 cal...

https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-VX-Fr.../dp/B07RV4RSNL

In stock, for $349. If only...
Worth the watch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DkALBk7bd8
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Old April 28, 2020, 19:57   #8
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Originally Posted by kotengu View Post
If only there was a US made red dot (with BDC, even) with great glass that has a gold ring lifetime warranty and will stand up to the abuse of anything under 50 cal...

https://www.amazon.com/Leupold-VX-Fr.../dp/B07RV4RSNL

In stock, for $349. If only...
So snarky....

I don't really need a BDC on a red dot. I'm good to 200 yds with one for humanoid MOA targets, but realize my eyes have really gone down hill the past few years. Besides, I can hold 8" at 300 yards if needed and if I'm shooting further need magnification, though that didn't stop me from trying the irons at 400 today (with poor results, lol)

This is a good $100 cheaper than the Aimpoint PRO. I'll have to think about it. I kinda like the red dot, but when it gets bright my astigmatism causes a little blurring of the dot.

My worsening eyesight was the most noticeable thing on my range trip today, but it felt good to get some trigger time in, and make some hits on the 18" gong at 400 yards with the scoped FAL and AR10.
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Old April 28, 2020, 20:20   #9
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Good video. For $350 and a Leupold warranty I've already taken the chance though. It has all the features I need at a reasonable price point with a great warranty and it's made in the USA.

I'm sure it's not as good as optics twice its price, but I'm not willing to spend twice this on a simple red dot.
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Old April 28, 2020, 20:24   #10
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Originally Posted by rowjimmy View Post
So snarky....

I don't really need a BDC on a red dot. I'm good to 200 yds with one for humanoid MOA targets, but realize my eyes have really gone down hill the past few years. Besides, I can hold 8" at 300 yards if needed and if I'm shooting further need magnification, though that didn't stop me from trying the irons at 400 today (with poor results, lol)

This is a good $100 cheaper than the Aimpoint PRO. I'll have to think about it. I kinda like the red dot, but when it gets bright my astigmatism causes a little blurring of the dot.

My worsening eyesight was the most noticeable thing on my range trip today, but it felt good to get some trigger time in, and make some hits on the 18" gong at 400 yards with the scoped FAL and AR10.
You can get the non-BDC version for around $100 less if you want it. For $350 I like the added value of the BDC to keep me from guessing at holds with no reticle references.

But you're right in that I have an awfully hard time seeing targets at any distance in real life lighting conditions - RNG taught me that and the value of a good optic. But this dot is for a gamer gun to play in "Limited" type rulesets, so it will fit perfectly for its task. I only brought it up because you sounded like you wanted a dot.

FWIW - one of the top Heavy Metal shooters in the nation uses this dot and speaks very well of it. That's what finally pushed me to order mine. Full disclosure: it'll be here Wednesday and I haven't actually used it at all yet.
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Old April 28, 2020, 20:49   #11
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You can get the non-BDC version for around $100 less if you want it. For $350 I like the added value of the BDC to keep me from guessing at holds with no reticle references.

But you're right in that I have an awfully hard time seeing targets at any distance in real life lighting conditions - RNG taught me that and the value of a good optic. But this dot is for a gamer gun to play in "Limited" type rulesets, so it will fit perfectly for its task. I only brought it up because you sounded like you wanted a dot.

FWIW - one of the top Heavy Metal shooters in the nation uses this dot and speaks very well of it. That's what finally pushed me to order mine. Full disclosure: it'll be here Wednesday and I haven't actually used it at all yet.
I do appreciate the reference. I may try it. It's for my DSA FAL, so a red dot on an 8 moa gun (lol) is probably just fine.

It's the only thing I have with only irons at this point, and maybe I should keep it like that.
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Old April 29, 2020, 20:00   #12
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The Vortex are back in stock...is the 1x8 worth the extra $100?

My eyes ain't getting any younger, lol.
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Old April 29, 2020, 21:56   #13
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The Vortex are back in stock...is the 1x8 worth the extra $100?

My eyes ain't getting any younger, lol.
6 is plenty for me - but it's totally up to you.

You didn't ask, but the new Leupold arrived tonight and I feel like I have to share. The only other red dot I have to compare it to is an old Aimpoint M2, which is fitting because that video posted earlier said it was essentially M2 technology but without the battery life.

It is about the same size and weight as the M2. At first glance, I thought the M2 had better glass than the Leupold, but when I really looked at little things far off I could see way more detail through the Leupold than the Aimpoint. There is a slightly different color hue to the two that makes it appear different, but the glass is definitely better on the Leupold.

You probably already know this, but anyone complaining about the precision of the dot has an eye problem. It is NOT the dot that's at fault. I noticed a HUGE difference when I switched from my right (dominant, but lower vision quality) to my left (better vision quality) eye when looking through the sight. Through my left it was a very precise 1 MOA dot - MUCH better than the 4 MOA aimpoint. And if you turn up the intensity it's huge and easy to see for fast shots. Through my right eye it's a goofy-shaped blob, no matter how low I turn the intensity. It's to the point I may choose to shoot long targets left-handed with this sight. It'd be good practice anyway, I guess.

I'm not too worried about the other "flaw" with the Leupold - the battery life. My VX6 has the same motion activated technology and the battery on it lasts around a year for me. And it's always on when I pick it up. I can't tell you how many people I've seen start a stage and forget to turn their dot on - so this feature is worth it to me.

We'll see if the lens falls out when I shoot it, but so far I'm happy.
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Old April 30, 2020, 09:30   #14
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6 is plenty for me - but it's totally up to you.

You didn't ask, but the new Leupold arrived tonight and I feel like I have to share. The only other red dot I have to compare it to is an old Aimpoint M2, which is fitting because that video posted earlier said it was essentially M2 technology but without the battery life.

It is about the same size and weight as the M2. At first glance, I thought the M2 had better glass than the Leupold, but when I really looked at little things far off I could see way more detail through the Leupold than the Aimpoint. There is a slightly different color hue to the two that makes it appear different, but the glass is definitely better on the Leupold.

You probably already know this, but anyone complaining about the precision of the dot has an eye problem. It is NOT the dot that's at fault. I noticed a HUGE difference when I switched from my right (dominant, but lower vision quality) to my left (better vision quality) eye when looking through the sight. Through my left it was a very precise 1 MOA dot - MUCH better than the 4 MOA aimpoint. And if you turn up the intensity it's huge and easy to see for fast shots. Through my right eye it's a goofy-shaped blob, no matter how low I turn the intensity. It's to the point I may choose to shoot long targets left-handed with this sight. It'd be good practice anyway, I guess.

I'm not too worried about the other "flaw" with the Leupold - the battery life. My VX6 has the same motion activated technology and the battery on it lasts around a year for me. And it's always on when I pick it up. I can't tell you how many people I've seen start a stage and forget to turn their dot on - so this feature is worth it to me.

We'll see if the lens falls out when I shoot it, but so far I'm happy.
Good feedback Kotengu, thanks! This DSA FAL, like most, is more battle axe than DMR, lol. So I'm on the fence about the dot versus magnified optic thing. I really like the ACSS reticle in the Primary Arms scope, but the Vortex reticle is decent too. I feel like the reticle is canted a bit in the PA scope though, (I've sent one back for that problem previously) because I used a bubble level to check the rifle and scope housing and they are on, but then the reticle seems canted a bit. But, I was hitting the steel gong at 400 with the AR10 using the BDC on the scope, so it must be "OK" The clarity of the glass on the Strike Eagle I have seems a bit better.
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Old May 01, 2020, 11:44   #15
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So I ended up going with the 1x6 Strike Eagle and mount. $423 shipped (PSA is apparently charging tax in PA now.)

The scope works pretty well on my STG-58.

I'll give a report when I get her mounted up and out to the range.
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Old May 01, 2020, 12:15   #16
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So I ended up going with the 1x6 Strike Eagle and mount. $423 shipped (PSA is apparently charging tax in PA now.)

The scope works pretty well on my STG-58.

I'll give a report when I get her mounted up and out to the range.
I would definitely go with a 1-6 over a red dot if there weren't other limitations. My only worry is that we've seen a Strike Eagle fail at every single RNG I've been to. I hope your experience is better than that, and look forward to hearing how you love it!

Maybe even some picture or your newly frocked riFAL with some bunnies and kitties or something.
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Old May 01, 2020, 19:31   #17
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I find 1-6 pretty ideal overall for 7.62, I have not really heard much bad about Vortex stuff in general, not that I have any (at the moment anyway).



Quote:
Originally Posted by kotengu View Post
Good video. For $350 and a Leupold warranty I've already taken the chance though. It has all the features I need at a reasonable price point with a great warranty and it's made in the USA.

I'm sure it's not as good as optics twice its price, but I'm not willing to spend twice this on a simple red dot.
The interesting feature to me was the "shake awake" function, I can see that being quite useful for house gun(s) in particular. The price seems fair for what it is.
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Old May 01, 2020, 19:48   #18
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I would definitely go with a 1-6 over a red dot if there weren't other limitations. My only worry is that we've seen a Strike Eagle fail at every single RNG I've been to. I hope your experience is better than that, and look forward to hearing how you love it!
Could have mentioned that EARLIER in the thread...


Quote:
Maybe even some picture or your newly frocked riFAL with some bunnies and kitties or something.
IDK, I really like the pink kryptek camo...

I still never ordered those damn screws you recommended for the DSA mounts. But I still have the screenshot with your post and the mcmaster product description on my desktop since 2016.

I just used some blue loctite an the ones that started to strip. But I should really get those screws.
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Old May 02, 2020, 09:51   #19
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Sorry man - I didn't know you were looking at a Strike Eagle! The good news is that Vortex really does deliver on their warranty.
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Old May 02, 2020, 10:50   #20
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Sorry man - I didn't know you were looking at a Strike Eagle! The good news is that Vortex really does deliver on their warranty.
Well, the one I ran Pawnee with a few years ago held up ok, but that's a pretty small sample set.

I figured it was a given stating my price range, but could have been clearer.
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Old May 06, 2020, 17:32   #21
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Strike Eagle came today. Hope to take her out this weekend but may have some conflicts. They changed the reticle a bit, more "tacticool" now.

PSA advertises their BDC's are good with 5.56 or 7.62. Vortex says 5.56, but the trajectories are close enough it should work.

This will be mounted on my 4 moa precision riFAL.
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Old May 09, 2020, 18:59   #22
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Strike Eagle came today. Hope to take her out this weekend but may have some conflicts. They changed the reticle a bit, more "tacticool" now.

PSA advertises their BDC's are good with 5.56 or 7.62. Vortex says 5.56, but the trajectories are close enough it should work.

This will be mounted on my 4 moa precision riFAL.
Good deal - I finally got to shoot my new dot this morning, and the rear lens didn't fall out or anything! It's a long way from being "proven", but it's off to a great start.

I use 5.56 BDCs for 7.62 all the time. They really are close enough in most cases, and as long as you know where they differ you're fine.
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Old May 22, 2020, 12:17   #23
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Good deal - I finally got to shoot my new dot this morning, and the rear lens didn't fall out or anything! It's a long way from being "proven", but it's off to a great start.

I use 5.56 BDCs for 7.62 all the time. They really are close enough in most cases, and as long as you know where they differ you're fine.

FYI for those who might be interested:

Vortex 1x8 Strike Eagle on sale at PSA (with mount) for $350 with discount code "strike". That's $40 cheaper than I paid for the 1x6...it's like $140 off.
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Old May 22, 2020, 13:13   #24
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Vortex has a number of models made in China by the communist. Some made in Japan and some in the Philippines. Leupold is made in America, Oregon however might be seen as a communist country.

https://riflescope-review.com/where-...x-scopes-made/
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Old May 23, 2020, 10:05   #25
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Vortex has a number of models made in China by the communist. Some made in Japan and some in the Philippines. Leupold is made in America, Oregon however might be seen as a communist country.

https://riflescope-review.com/where-...x-scopes-made/
I have several Diamondback HP scopes marked "Made in Philippines". They are two or three years old, maybe the HP makes them different than a standard "Diamondback", I donno.
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Old June 01, 2020, 07:19   #26
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So I mounted the Vortex on my FAL. The mount raises the scope a bit so I don't get as good of a cheek weld.

Better to try and find lower rings or get a cheek pad to ad to the stock?

Suggestions? Rifel shoots OK for a DSA FAL with the optic.
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Old June 01, 2020, 09:16   #27
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I'd got with two piece rings and lower the scope if your rail allows you. Sometimes you need the 1 1/2" or 2" offset the "one-piece" mount gives you for eye relief.

With the scope mounted, you should be able to determine if you can mount it in the same position with rings. Several of my scopes need extension rings to give proper eye relief on a rail.
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Old June 01, 2020, 11:36   #28
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I'd got with two piece rings and lower the scope if your rail allows you. Sometimes you need the 1 1/2" or 2" offset the "one-piece" mount gives you for eye relief.

With the scope mounted, you should be able to determine if you can mount it in the same position with rings. Several of my scopes need extension rings to give proper eye relief on a rail.
Thanks for the feedback. I have EGW rings on my STG-58 on Imbel FAL and the ocular lens almost abuts the rear sight, but it's low and yields a good cheek weld.

I like the BDC reticle on the latest incarnation of the Strike Eagle a lot, as it includes a range estimator like the primary arms BDC, and got it from PSA for a decent price given it came with the mount. I wasn't thinking about the vertical offset of the mount.

I wish I would have waited as the Memorial Day sale would have allowed me to get the 1x8 Strike Eagle with mount for $50 less...


I hate to buy rings to add insult to injury. I'll have to try some positional shooting and see if I can make this work, if not I'll get the low mount rings.
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Old June 02, 2020, 22:10   #29
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RJ if you can post a pic of the vortex on your Fal that would be awesome. I'm looking to do something similar with my STG. I am not happy with the fixed 4x post reticle Hensdolt on it right now.
I have seen lots of "out of stock" also. I wanted a Primary Arms 1x8x24mm FFP ACSS raptor to put on my VEPR but they are out of stock. Everywhere. I can get the SFP one at Primary Arms but I want the FFP. Looking at the PA website I noticed they had the Glx 2.5x10x44 FFP illuminated ACSS Raptor in stock. It's a little bit more but looks like it might work out ok on the VEPR so it's on order. This one is made in the Philippines I think which is good because so is my wife. We will see PA can restock this month as they are claiming so I can get something for the STG.
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Old June 03, 2020, 10:53   #30
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RJ if you can post a pic of the vortex on your Fal that would be awesome. I'm looking to do something similar with my STG. I am not happy with the fixed 4x post reticle Hensdolt on it right now.
I have seen lots of "out of stock" also. I wanted a Primary Arms 1x8x24mm FFP ACSS raptor to put on my VEPR but they are out of stock. Everywhere. I can get the SFP one at Primary Arms but I want the FFP. Looking at the PA website I noticed they had the Glx 2.5x10x44 FFP illuminated ACSS Raptor in stock. It's a little bit more but looks like it might work out ok on the VEPR so it's on order. This one is made in the Philippines I think which is good because so is my wife. We will see PA can restock this month as they are claiming so I can get something for the STG.
I'll see if I can get some pics uploaded when I get home. Don't know if I still have my photobucket account or if there is an easier way. I think they still have the 1x6 Strike Eagle at PSA and honestly, the new reticle is probably just as good as the PA ACSS one, maybe clearer glass.

I will post pics with the low rings and Vortex raised mount for comparison.
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Old June 03, 2020, 20:37   #31
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Sorry bro, it took me a while to get my shit together today. This is a pic with DSA mount and Evolution Gun Works (EGW) low profile tactical scope rings:


https://photos.app.goo.gl/y3km3k5iiZtsuBwC9

This one is with the Vortex raised mount:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hPQBweKXgQscrT8o6

The tactical rings give the preferred cheek weld, but you've got to get the eye relief right as it abuts the rear sight on mine. I might even move it forward a hair to adjust the focus on the ocular, my eyes have gotten a little older the past two years.

The Vortex mount allows a lower cheek bone/jaw placement which is less desirable, but still enables ana ccurtae shot and works from prone too.

Last edited by rowjimmy; June 03, 2020 at 20:44.
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Old June 03, 2020, 20:45   #32
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LMK if you can't see the pics I don't seem to be able to embed them no matter what I do.
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Old June 03, 2020, 20:56   #33
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I've played with a lot of scopes/mounts/rings on an FAL and at least for me, I found a lot of options that worked well in everything but prone position.
Standing, sitting, kneeling, bench, I can always lean my head a bit forward if needed. Prone however, I could not back away enough or mount the scope forward enough to work well for eye relief.

My current "race gun" FAL set-up sports a Burris, but again I found a lot that worked for me, Vortex and Leopold options to name just two. Finally, I bought a long stock, and also with a 3/8" spacer behind the BP. Problem solved shooting prone. YMMV.


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Old June 03, 2020, 21:15   #34
rowjimmy
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I've played with a lot of scopes/mounts/rings on an FAL and at least for me, I found a lot of options that worked well in everything but prone position.
Standing, sitting, kneeling, bench, I can always lean my head a bit forward if needed. Prone however, I could not back away enough or mount the scope forward enough to work well for eye relief.

My current "race gun" FAL set-up sports a Burris, but again I found a lot that worked for me, Vortex and Leopold options to name just two. Finally, I bought a long stock, and also with a 3/8" spacer behind the BP. Problem solved shooting prone. YMMV.


Cool pic. I would think that sand bag out that far would effect barrel harmonics and POI. I've always held/supported close to the mag well.

Is that an Izzy LB? I don't know my FAL's like these guys.
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Old June 03, 2020, 21:37   #35
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Cool pic. I would think that sand bag out that far would effect barrel harmonics and POI. I've always held/supported close to the mag well.

Is that an Izzy LB? I don't know my FAL's like these guys.
It's an Imbel on Imbel build with a lot of other stuff thrown in (and a lot of other, other stuff tried and discarded). Extended safety, inch mag release, barrel cut to 18", mini-stoll, long butt stock, Izzy hand guards...a FrankenFAL that fits me for my purpose.

Barrel harmonics/POI is sighted in to be resting on the Izzy HG wood, whether that is my left hand, a rest, or otherwise. It works for me.
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Old June 03, 2020, 21:43   #36
rowjimmy
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It's an Imbel on Imbel build with a lot of other stuff thrown in (and a lot of other, other stuff tried and discarded). Extended safety, inch mag release, barrel cut to 18", mini-stoll, long butt stock, Izzy hand guards...a FrankenFAL that fits me for my purpose.

Barrel harmonics/POI is sighted in to be resting on the Izzy HG wood, whether that is my left hand, a rest, or otherwise. It works for me.
Who don't love a good Frankenfal?
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Old June 04, 2020, 23:16   #37
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Sorry bro, it took me a while to get my shit together today. This is a pic with DSA mount and Evolution Gun Works (EGW) low profile tactical scope rings:


https://photos.app.goo.gl/y3km3k5iiZtsuBwC9

This one is with the Vortex raised mount:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hPQBweKXgQscrT8o6

The tactical rings give the preferred cheek weld, but you've got to get the eye relief right as it abuts the rear sight on mine. I might even move it forward a hair to adjust the focus on the ocular, my eyes have gotten a little older the past two years.

The Vortex mount allows a lower cheek bone/jaw placement which is less desirable, but still enables ana ccurtae shot and works from prone too.
Looks great, thank you RJ. Prone shooting and I have some issues. :-)
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Old June 05, 2020, 17:29   #38
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Well the scope came today. Pretty fast shipping. Might get it mounted up this evening.

PAGLX - Copy

PAGLX3 - Copy
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Old June 05, 2020, 21:07   #39
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Sweet, show a pic with her mounted up and give a range report!
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